Best OSR System
- Thread starter Evard's Small Tentacle
- Start date
TerribleSorcery
Should be playing D&D instead
Has any OSR system done anything worth paying money for in the last decade? Way back when it was worth buying Labyrinth Lord, S&W, OSRIC or whatever because the originals were out of print and there were all those legal issues to work around.
Today things are different. When I hear that someone has yet another version of B/X but "better organized" I just laugh. Has anyone advanced an argument for OSE other than this? Because I haven't heard it. How easy to read does the simple version of the game for kids have to be, especially considering AD&D is totally playable by a somewhat smart teenager? Can someone give me a justification that isn't Must Consume Product? Sometimes I know how Kent feels.
Today things are different. When I hear that someone has yet another version of B/X but "better organized" I just laugh. Has anyone advanced an argument for OSE other than this? Because I haven't heard it. How easy to read does the simple version of the game for kids have to be, especially considering AD&D is totally playable by a somewhat smart teenager? Can someone give me a justification that isn't Must Consume Product? Sometimes I know how Kent feels.
TerribleSorcery
Should be playing D&D instead
LL too, you can get art-free versions on the Goblinoid website.
PrinceofNothing
High Executarch
ACKS probably. As a tarted up B/X with a fixed proficiency system it is adequate, its alternate raise dead complication rules are terrific, combat is tight, but its the economic system that underlies the whole thing that just works beautifully. It expands the framework in a direction that needed a systematic approach and it makes sandboxing that much sweeter. I have a level 6 fighter and a level 6 magic user.
TerribleSorcery
Should be playing D&D instead
A good economic/domain system is something that's been badly needed for years in D&D, so that might be worth the price of admission. Concocting that stuff myself has never worked out very well.
PrinceofNothing
High Executarch
I think the Core rules are free so you can always check them out. It's really very tight. A bit uninspiring on the face of it, you won't find any fancy layout or fonts there, but very good.
Malrex
So ... slow work day? Every day?
I agree with you for the most part, but from a publisher perspective:
After delving into OSE for a conversion, I believe there IS value in organization. It's not just how easy it is to read or understand, but also how quickly one can look up rules during the game, scan it, and keep playing smoothly. According to Bryce, it's pretty important to be able to scan an adventure while at the table...why isn't it valuable to have that component for a ruleset as well?
Publishing adventures for OSE are way less of a headache for me as I can find specific rulings quickly and efficiently and move on with my ideas. That's just my own experience/comparison of writing modules for the different retroclones. Surprisingly, I don't regret spending money on OSE even though all the retroclones to me are just regurgitated information (except DCC had a bunch of new ideas). The presentation feels 'new' and useful as hell--like a big dungeon screen...and I've easily read more of OSE than say LL or OSRIC and not on purpose---it was just easy to do while looking up rulings (is there a list of differences between LL and OSRIC out of curiosity?)
There is also support for publishers with OSE--they provide a style guide which I haven't really seen from other rulesets. Players probably wouldn't find that valuable, but I found it very refreshing to have some support and direction for adventure presentation--a small thing, but it motivated me to want to write for that particular system. Best rule system though? nahh, I'll stick with the original 2e/1e.
I agree with you that economic/domain rules or something new would be more interesting for new retro-clones.
squeen
8, 8, I forget what is for
ACKS Domains at War impressed me too. Very much. As a DM I really liked what it revealed about armies. I paid the price for the print edition and was happy to do so. It has two version Domain Play Mode (strategy and resources), and Mass Combat Action (with PC & spells).
That said...my group didn't like playing it...AND I didn't like having to converting (AD&D) to it --- so I am still looking for a better beast for mass combat. Something accurate AD&D, but also fast for the players.
LL is a modified B/X-ish clone, right? Where as OSRIC is definitely is 1e.
That said...my group didn't like playing it...AND I didn't like having to converting (AD&D) to it --- so I am still looking for a better beast for mass combat. Something accurate AD&D, but also fast for the players.
LL is a modified B/X-ish clone, right? Where as OSRIC is definitely is 1e.
grodog
Should be playing D&D instead
I don’t know of one off the top of my head, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. I’ve definitely read such lists for AD&D vs. OSRIC, and having a list for each platform in one place might be nice.
I’ve worked up a few style guides for AD&D and OSRIC publishers, hadn’t thought about making them generally-available via the OSRIC sites. I’ll add it to the To Do list.
I haven’t looked at the ACKS rules for a long time; what stood out as particularly useful?
Allan.
robertsconley
Should be playing D&D instead
Well you can download it for free and see what the hoopla is about.
Old-School Essentials Basic Rules
Old-School Essentials is an award-winning role-playing game of fantastic adventure, monsters, and magic. Players delve into forbidden crypts and forsaken ruins, explore haunted forests and perilous mountain ranges, sail the high seas in search of lost lands, recover fabulous treasures and...
necroticgnome.com
Having used the product line as a player, all I can say that it works as a better reference than the original (which I have) when you are trying to use the books. Similar to how some people like looking up stuff in OSRIC compared to the original AD&D manuals.
robertsconley
Should be playing D&D instead
As for the general issue, OSE is the only "clone" set of rules I seen release recently that got any traction. Everything else including my own Majestic Fantasy RPG reflect a particular vision of the author implemented using classic editions mechanics.
I would have been happy to continue to release Swords & Wizardry supplements for the rules stuff I do and keep my focus 100% on adventures and setting. But it hard to sell stuff physically (stores and cons) without having an accompanying rulebook. While the Swords & Wizardry book is open content the book itself is not free to cope with its art and cover. The math to buy copies doesn't work out. And distribution is not wide spread enough for stores. Hence I am publishing my own take. But given my original focus, I am keeping it highly compatible with Swords & Wizardry.
PrinceofNothing
High Executarch
Market classes, alternate death threshold rules, alternate ressurection complications, integrated rules for using monster parts to craft magic items, expanded rules for followers and hirelings, the proficiency system is good to the point where I'd say it sort of 'fixed' the one started in 2e and GAZ1 and all the advanced Magical Rituals stuff is cool too.
But...but...but if we do not Consume Product how can we Get Excited For Next Product To Consume?
robertsconley
Should be playing D&D instead
The math behind the implementation is solid. I recommend picking up Axioms #3 if you want to read some of the details of why it works the way it does. And it straight forward enough (and open content) that you can develop your own take, which I did for my Majestic Fantasy stuff.