Different Dimensions....Planar travel

[Malrex]

I used to be intimidated by doing city adventures but after doing a few, I found I really enjoy putting them together. I'm hoping that's the case with different dimensions and planar adventures because they intimidate me too....so that's one reason why I want to tackle one--to go outside my comfort zone. In about 3 months, I plan to work on a project for my Patreon and may publish it to Drivethrurpg. It's a part 2 to Tar Pits of the Bone Toilers, and its where the party may decide to go through the Maw of Ghormaug which is a portal that leads to a different dimension called the The Marrow Ravine. I hesitated to post this since it feels weird to discuss something I may publish and don't want it to sound like I'm fishing for ideas. I got about 90% of it thought out in my head already. So rather, I'm merely fishing for opinions and discussion from those interested. And its the 'project workshop' so..why not?

One complaint that I have seen on Bryce's reviews and something that I agree with, is high level adventures taking away certain spells or having them not work. I am entertaining the idea of doing the opposite--making spells more powerful, because I think it could lead to other consequences. Doubling the area of effect of fireballs, fly being so effective it won't allow you to touch the ground, casting knock on the door and other random things pop open--belt buckles, potion bottles, etc. Same with clerics, as this dimension may be closer to the heavens...which may increase their spell power from their deity. I'm still mulling things over about it and wondering if its worth it because organizing the 'new' rules could really boost the clutter, not to mention the hell that may be razed against the players and against the monsters. Might be totally off balance and out of whack...but that might be ok for a one shot?? The idea is for spellcasters to really think about their spell choices and tactics. What other problems might you find for that?

With a different dimension, I'm also trying to think about the environment. I think the air is going to be different, and characters may need to make a saving throw every hour or take a little damage. I'm going after the 'place is dangerous' vibe, while trying to avoid the annoyance of it...but also going after tension. "I'm wounded bad...and without healing...in one hour its possible this gas might finally kill me." I'm still debating about it and may restrict this to a few areas with more checks (1/turn) instead of everywhere but not sure. Would you find the continual damage more of an annoyance or would it serve as a tension device?

Finally...with wilderness and city adventures---its hard for me to find the perimeter of the adventure. Where do you stop? I want to add a dimensional threat...as all the factions are trying to leave the dimension. So a wall or barrier that slowly is moving in, destroying the dimension is one idea...but I feel like that's been done before somewhere? Another thought is to just focus on the Ravine....and perhaps the DM can expand the dimension if they want and maybe I could throw in some ideas. Which path seems more enticing?

 

[Yora]

I think if the party is going to visit a place for only one session and then return to their own world, you can go pretty crazy and completely ignore any worries about any classes getting huge boosts or drawbacks.

However, I think it still needs to be manageable at the table. Rolling for damage once per hour isn't so bad if the total time spend in that plane is maybe 5 or 8 hours. But when they might stay a whole day or more, I think it would quickly become more of a chore and quite difficult to actually keep track of in practice.

 

[The1True]

At high levels, the spellcasters are already super powered as it is. If you multiply the effects of their high level spells, it's going to render the other classes in the party (even more) inconsequential to the scenario. Maybe follow any of the various guides to the planes and pick one particular aspect of magic to increase and an opposing school to penalize? Otherwise, consider finding a way to exaggerate the abilities of the other classes as well (giant JRPG-style weapons etc.) Obviously, most of the main challenges will have to be tests of role playing rather than ridiculous might...

Is this a pocket dimension or an infinite plane? Maybe make it moebius so if you step off the map at one end you pop back on at the other? Do you plan on allowing the PC's to come and go? On one hand you could contain the plane in a sphere of force with carefully controlled gateways; on the other you could bound the realm in the silvery fogs of the aether and let people wander off into neighbouring or transitional planes if they want to stubbornly stumble off the narrative without a Planeshift or Greater Teleport.

For high level play, don't be afraid to grind the PC's. Hit them with damage every Turn. It's a lot easier to keep track of the damage if it's happening constantly and it will instill greater feelings of dread. They will quickly come up with solutions to the problem right at the outset and forget about it (as will the DM) ...until... they wander through that Anti-magic field or get hit by that Greater Dispel and then boom, they're low on resources and taking damage and time is running out. I think the trouble there might be that if you're running a fairly open scenario, PC's will just teleport to safety, re-memorize, re-buff and everybody will end up annoyed by the inconvenience more than anything else. Maybe save the buff negation for the tense final act where fiats that limit easy escape might be expected and acceptable?

 

[The1True]

I hesitated to post this since it feels weird to discuss something I may publish

Thanks for being cool. Even as an amateur I'm hesitant to post questions online for fear of having my half-assed ideas stolen or worse yet finding out that someone else has had the same damn idea and is a lot farther along with it. It would be very cool if this were a place where people actually felt free to share ideas without worrying about future legal hassle. I don't know what the actual international laws are, but I'd like to imagine that if you openly discuss your work in a public forum like this, it's understood that people offering advice and suggestions are giving up all claims to your work. Conversely however if that inspires their own work, as long as it's not out-and-out plagiarism, I guess you have to be cool about that in return?
I'm kind of viewing this whole forum currently as an adventure incubator. Am I wrong?

 

[Malrex]

I'm kind of viewing this whole forum currently as an adventure incubator. Am I wrong?

That was the impression/vibe I had so I figured I would go for it--but admittedly it took me a few weeks to finally decide to write something. My view is that this forum setup is like a school. We are learning how to be better designers and for a place to hang and BS. That's one of the reasons why I like reading the reviews--to learn different layout options and ideas. And with the subject matter that Bryce has posted, there is a lot to research and potentially learn from. I don't agree with everything, but have learned a lot and agree with most. I think most designers don't really get any feedback until the review and if there was a place where ideas might get polished up a bit, or a place to discuss someone's work so they can improve next time, it would benefit all of us? For example, your statement above that if magic power is increased, the other classes might feel inconsequential--good fucking point and noted!

I also view designing adventures as a hobby and would rather avoid all the legal hassle all together. If someone offers up advice or suggestions that I end up using, I usually ask the person if its cool if I use it and then I'm more than happy to credit them on the credit page and I send them a free copy when done. And if my dumb ass ideas inspire someone else's work--then kick ass, I'd be excited to read it.

 

[Yora]

You can't steal ideas. You can only copy gimicks, but those don't matter. If your main selling point is a gimick, then the whole thing doesn't really have any substance to begin with.
It's how you execute your idea that makes or breaks the final thing, and that will always be completely different for all creators.

 

[TerribleSorcery]

"Doubling the area of effect of fireballs, fly being so effective it won't allow you to touch the ground, casting knock on the door and other random things pop open--belt buckles, potion bottles, etc. Same with clerics, as this dimension may be closer to the heavens...which may increase their spell power from their deity. I'm still mulling things over about it and wondering if its worth it because organizing the 'new' rules could really boost the clutter, not to mention the hell that may be razed against the players and against the monsters. Might be totally off balance and out of whack...but that might be ok for a one shot?? The idea is for spellcasters to really think about their spell choices and tactics. What other problems might you find for that?"

This is a really great idea, I don't know of any other adventures that do this, but you'll have to approach it carefully. If the DM has never bothered about the area of a fireball before and players are used to throwing them around with impunity, then it might feel like a screw-job. Of course that's something you can't control. There are so many spells out there, you can't possibly come up with guidelines for every single one. No matter how comprehensive your system is, it will still require the DM's adjudicating. I feel like you could dig yourself into a bottomless pit trying to anticipate the changes to every type of spell.

 

[Grützi]

Don't know if this is still relevant, but here are my two cents.

Forgetting about balance and the like for a one-shot or a "once visited" location seems ok to me. Mixes things up a bit and rattles players out of their routine.

Changing/Enhancing/Dimishing spell effects:
Great way of showing players that things work differently here. Care must be taken not to overload players with new rules and changes.
Instead of changing every single spell in detail you could go with broad thematic changes. So instead of changing every detail you'll define some broad key words, give rules for each one and how they interact with each other and then simply indicate which keywords are "active" at any given time.
Possible themes/key words: The four classical elements,wood, metals or such stuff. Or even more metaphysical themes like change, destruction, healing, life stealing, darkness, light, .... You could also indicate enviromental dangers with this system: choking, freezing, burning, ...etc.

Give each key word a few general rules and slap them onto your locations.

Example:
Choking: -1 to all rolls, another 0-2 to strength and constituion related rolls,
Fire: anything fire related does 1d4 more damage and produces double the normal light.
Change: Whenever a character takes damage he/she can choose to "change" that damage into a negative modifier for his next roll and ignore the damage. Only once per round.
Healing: Triple the normal healing rate, anything eaten here heals1d6 damage

Another way:
If you like it a bit more random you could create a small effect table for every keyword. Everytime the group enters a new location the DM rolls for the effects of the keywords associated with that location. Could get tiresome for the DM ... but is easily solved by letting the players roll for the effects. Players love to roll for stuff Maybe give players a way to influence the result of the effect roll?

Damage every turn/round?
Seems tiresome to me. And straight damage is a bit boring I think.
I love to give my players the choice of getting a boon for a price or ignoring it.
So instead of damage every X minutes let's try this:
Everyone on the plane of Valor can try feats of great strength and endurance. Every character can give himself a+4 bonus on strength or constitution related rolls and abilties (like HP) for a round but has to roll a d6 right afterwards.
1: -1d4 Strength or constituion until next long rest.
2 to 3: -1d6 HP
4 to 5: -1d4 HP
6: +1 on strength or constitution for the next 6 hours

Dimensional threat
I would full on go crazy here. This is not the normal, prime material plane your guys and gals are on. So turn the knob all the way to eleven.
Maybe a giant demon face is at the horizon, slowly eating the plane always coming closer. Maybe the darkness itself is trying to drag the plane back into the primordial void ... so everything not constantly illuminated simply vanishes forever.
The specific threat isn't even that important (except when your plan is to fight against it ) but I think the imagery here is the most important aspect.
Show your players that they are not in Kansas anymore ... the weirder and stranger the better

 

[Malrex]

All great stuff. The adventure is on the backburner, but def. going to attack it at some point.