Ask Melan

Two orcs

Officially better than you, according to PoN
I had something even more blatant in my Stonehell: replacing the orc lair (just 5 rooms with a guard post) with a sublevel holding a full sized medieval castle sitting in a lake of acid. The first big fight of the campaign was the assault on the castle.
 

LuckyLegs

A FreshHell to Contend With
Well I bought a bunch of EMDT stuff and it rocks! So far I'm finding everything very quick to read and absorb (GM-friendly indeed ;)), as well as exciting—this stuff makes me want to play! I'm gearing up to run The Vaults of Volokarnos very soon, and am hoping to maybe lure my players to Erillion after that. Pumped.

I've got a few questions

Morale & Men
I realise these rules were by guest authors but I'm hoping Melan or someone else will be able to help me out. To me they were pretty unclear at first. I dunno, maybe I'm just thick. To clarify the initial procedure:
  • Percentile dice are rolled for every troop type to determine whether or not volunteers from each category are present.
  • Dice are rolled per the settlement size for each present volunteer type to determine numbers.
  • Names and morale (and possibly level; also possibly unscrupulousness later on) are generated for each individual volunteer.
    (Anything else? Race? I saw at least one elf halberdier among the list of "Reavers".)
  • Presumably, players get given numbers of troops by type (and level) to hire from and away they go, with names being given to track individuals once hired.
Have I got all that right?

A few more questions:
  1. Are players aware of a volunteer's morale rating at any point, or is that kept secret and tracked by the referee?
  2. Am I right in assuming these guys take a share of XP as per classic retainer rules?
  3. Are they expected to advance in level as well? Or are these retainers considered too temporary or transient to really go into that?
  4. What exactly happens when the recruit pool "recovers"? Is the pool completely generated anew, or do old volunteers stick around?
  5. "In baseline games, retainers are 1 HD." Does this also apply to non-combatants? Do they also get the "Bledsawian" roll if that's in effect? My first instinct when I read "non-combatants" was that they'd be Normal Humans. Is the non-combatant thing simply referring to the gear they come with, and they still basically have Fighter levels?
  6. Are Bledsawian demographics in effect in Arak Brannia as they are in Erillion?
  7. A couple differences I noted between issues which I was hoping for some clarification on:
    1. Echoes #09 states that in Arak Brannia there should be 1d4 volunteers from each category using the "town" column, but the original table in Echoes #01 says 1d6 for towns.
    2. Echoes #09 also offers a different rule for advertising: 100gp per troop type, instead of 1d6x50gp "for a new check" (I'm not entirely sure if that also meant per troop type, or if it was supposed to mean starting from the top with the percentile rolls for each troop type, or).
I could make up my own answers but I'm hoping it won't hurt to ask for some help. Thanks for your time 🙏
 

LuckyLegs

A FreshHell to Contend With
Hello again 🙂
WRT gods in the "Wanderlands": how do you differentiate between followers, divine champions, and clerics?

I'm also wondering, is there an intended mechanical purpose for the weapons listed under each god?

Apologies if my last post was too detailed; I'm sure you probably have better things to do than to sift through all that 😅

I'm absolutely loving the adventure and setting materials; just stumbling a bit with these more rules-related topics.
 

Melan

*eyeroll*
Great to hear you are enjoying the zines! On Morale & Men: you've basically got it right. There are no specific guidelines for race, since our games are so humanocentric, but you could give it a flat chance (1:6 is always a good one), or adjust if they are in the elven kingdoms or similar place. I also let players name their basic hirelings, unless it is an established NPC joining them. Why not?

The questions:
  1. In Casemates & Companies, the rating is transparent. Managing a bunch of followers is an important part of the game. However, we also use a table of random NPC quirks (one is included in Castle Xyntillan, the other remains in Hungarian only, in the game's rules - perhaps a future zine article?), some of which would be revealed ("he is joining to support a large family"), and some not ("follower of a malevolent god", or "steals from the company").
  2. Zero-level guys don't, at least in C&C. You can invest 100 gp in one of them and turn them into a classed follower if you wish, upon which they roll their ability scores, and can from then on earn XP. C&C specifies that only your main character gets full XP; the others only gain 1/2.
  3. They are usually too transitory. They join, they die during adventures, or as their morale rating decreases, they eventually leave a company. This is not in the guidelines, but I usually check morale after particularly hazardous adventures to see if they stick around - this check does not further decrease their ML rating.
  4. It is rerolled - in a town, potential recruits may come and go.
  5. Non-combatants would be 1d6 Hp Normal Men indeed!
  6. No, we played Volokarnos (and Thisium) with C&C. I distinguish between the various campaigns we play, and although they are all D&Desque, I don't mix them up too much. C&C is a six-level system, where this closed scale of advancement applies to everyone - PCs and NPCs. In other games, such as those on Erillion and now the Twelve Kingdoms, advancement is open-ended (although practically, level 9-12 is as high as our campaigns tend to get). Bledsawian demographics only make sense under the second situation.
  7. The adventure is incorrect here (although you could say it is a special case!) - this is just a failure to remember, or check up on the original rules.
Will answer the other question when I can, but it is getting very late here. :)
 

LuckyLegs

A FreshHell to Contend With
Great to hear you are enjoying the zines! On Morale & Men: you've basically got it right. There are no specific guidelines for race, since our games are so humanocentric, but you could give it a flat chance (1:6 is always a good one), or adjust if they are in the elven kingdoms or similar place. I also let players name their basic hirelings, unless it is an established NPC joining them. Why not?

The questions:
  1. In Casemates & Companies, the rating is transparent. Managing a bunch of followers is an important part of the game. However, we also use a table of random NPC quirks (one is included in Castle Xyntillan, the other remains in Hungarian only, in the game's rules - perhaps a future zine article?), some of which would be revealed ("he is joining to support a large family"), and some not ("follower of a malevolent god", or "steals from the company").
  2. Zero-level guys don't, at least in C&C. You can invest 100 gp in one of them and turn them into a classed follower if you wish, upon which they roll their ability scores, and can from then on earn XP. C&C specifies that only your main character gets full XP; the others only gain 1/2.
  3. They are usually too transitory. They join, they die during adventures, or as their morale rating decreases, they eventually leave a company. This is not in the guidelines, but I usually check morale after particularly hazardous adventures to see if they stick around - this check does not further decrease their ML rating.
  4. It is rerolled - in a town, potential recruits may come and go.
  5. Non-combatants would be 1d6 Hp Normal Men indeed!
  6. No, we played Volokarnos (and Thisium) with C&C. I distinguish between the various campaigns we play, and although they are all D&Desque, I don't mix them up too much. C&C is a six-level system, where this closed scale of advancement applies to everyone - PCs and NPCs. In other games, such as those on Erillion and now the Twelve Kingdoms, advancement is open-ended (although practically, level 9-12 is as high as our campaigns tend to get). Bledsawian demographics only make sense under the second situation.
  7. The adventure is incorrect here (although you could say it is a special case!) - this is just a failure to remember, or check up on the original rules.
Will answer the other question when I can, but it is getting very late here. :)
Ah, that all helps immensely! Especially those extra nuggets of context about C&C, which mostly explain why certain little details were tripping me up (not knowing the assumed diversions from B/X). Cheers mate 🙏 Now I can do it all wrong on purpose!! :p
 

AutumnCrystal

A FreshHell to Contend With
LuckyLegs: Echoes From Fomalhaut currently covers two fairly different settings.

The first of these is an unnamed, fairly vanillaish setting (tentatively named "Wanderlands" or "Drifting Lands" until something better comes up) which includes: the Isle of Erillion, the Twelve Kingdoms, and the Kassadian Empire. The tone is more Gygaxian Greyhawk than Wilderlands; and in fact parts of the setting slots into Greyhawk without much difficulty. This setting mostly works from the AD&D core book baseline, with the same array of classes and races (although more humanocentric). Nevertheless, if it is in AD&D, it is in the setting. The few departure points are:
  • Monetary treasure is more scarce, approximately 1/5 of the book values. This can be handled with a *5 multiplier if desired.
  • Higher level magic-use (4th+ level spells) requires taking a test with a M-U organisation. This can be easily disregarded.
The three regions described so far:
  • The Isle of Erillion (issues #01 to #08, overview in #02, hex descriptions in #03-#04) is a large island, vaguely inspired by 13th century England. Erillion is ruled by a small maritime principality, inhabited on its coastal areas, but featuring lots of mountainous or forested wilderness in its interior. The tone is more or less vanilla. Also includes Baklin, Jewel of the Seas, a city supplement. The setting is now more or less "complete", although there are materials I would still like to publish for it in some form.
  • The Twelve Kingdoms (issues #08 and on, overview in #09) is a more northern archipelago of small, quarrelling kingdoms on a barren, wild northern land inspired by the Celtic fringe, Finland, and Jack Vance's Lyonesse novels. This is a slightly grimier shade of fantasy, although with touches of surreal stuff. This is the current focus of the zine.
  • The Kassadian Empire is the remains of a Rome-like empire that never fell, but disintegrated into numerous rival city-states and principalities. The style is "Roman ruins meet mediaeval Italy". This setting has a more specific style; decadent and cloak-and-dagger stuff. Not much of this setting has appeared specifically in the zine (except more recently, in issues #09 and #10), but a standalone module by a friend (In the Shadow of the City-God) has been released, and a large B/X sandbox campaign module is forthcoming in addition to two smaller OSRIC modules (this is a bit confusing, but that's how we played them).
The campaign materials from the first two would easily find a home in a general AD&D or D&D game. You may adjust things a bit, but no more than par for course, really. They should work both in their original context, and separately. You can also import existing modules easily, as I have done with various Judges Guild, TSR, and modern old-school materials.

The second main setting is the City of Vultures, a specific corner of the world of Fomalhaut (which has ironically received no coverage in the zine otherwise yet). This is a highly exotic campaign set in an ancient, decadent city-state ruled by shadowy conspiracies, and built on top of a deep, interconnected underworld from an age of lost high technology. The City of Vultures has been inspired by Indo-Persian civilisations, Empire of the Petal Throne, Fritz Lang's paranoid movies (and film noir in general), the Flash Gordon comics, and so forth. These materials appear from Echoes #03 and on, with increasing frequency from #06. An overview is found in #06, and a wilderness supplement in #08. Also of note is the Nocturnal Table, a supplement for generating city encounters and flavour that was originally developed for this city. You can try it for free on Chartopia (courtesy of tuirgin), and there is a comprehensive Fantasy Grounds implementation by EOTB.

This definitely carries very strong flavour and assumptions. It is almost completely humanocentric (some gnolls and goat-men notwithstanding), and has a strong weird fantasy/planetary romance element. The gods are petty and capricious, and the world is mostly independent city-states with a heavy emphasis on sailing and adventures on strange islands. The City of Vultures, and Fomalhaut in general would be a natural fit for Hyperborea or Seven Voyages of Zylarthen (the latter of which has no cleric class). Coincidentally, we have just started a Zylarthen campaign in the setting last weekend. PM me for our house rules doc if interested.

Hope this is helpful.
Will you be publishing a play report on the SVoZ campaign? I’m starting one with that ruleset on Wednesday and would love to compare.
“Bring it on, and let’s not forget: that Wisdom score is rolled with 2d6, no exceptions and no excuses.” Lol, just so.
 

Melan

*eyeroll*
Sadly, very unlikely. Campaign journals are very time-consuming (I have done a few), and after a time, you have to prioritise. It's actual gaming, publishing and blogging, pick two you can dedicate serious time to. Hence why my blog is now mostly reviews.
 

AutumnCrystal

A FreshHell to Contend With
Completely understandable. I ran my game with Seven Voyages last season, it went well enough I’ll be doing the same this season, which begins today:)Hence the curiosity. Happy Halloween!
 

LuckyLegs

A FreshHell to Contend With
Greetings again, Melan! My boys and I have been getting plenty of mileage out of the Vaults of Volokarnos; 14 (short-ish) sessions in and things have really grown. I suspect it won't be long til they set sail for adventure around the Coastlands, or Erillion (this is assuming they don't read a certain scroll and end up somewhere else first!).

I've been reading through your Erillion campaign journals and have noticed some Sword and Magic DNA (which I've since made myself familiar with). This got me wondering about how much S&M you use in your AD&D games, and about a few things in particular:
  • Do you provide human racial/background options in your Wanderlands/Drifting Lands games? I see a few of the PCs were labelled as Northmen, but I wasn't sure if this was a mechanical thing or just “fluff” (for lack of a better word).
  • What about fighter the “sub-classes”? Do you make changes to those? I saw references to Barbarian, but again wasn't sure if this was fluff or potentially another S&M thing. (On a related note, I noticed that there are no Lawful Good gods that allow swords in the Wanderlands/Drifting Lands “pantheon”… I would say RIP Paladins, but it doesn't seem like you guys would play with them anyway 😆)
Really curious to know about these first two as they look like they add a lot of flavour in S&M! Also,
  • How do you incorporate skills into your vanilla AD&D games? Is it pretty much the same DC-based system seen in S&M?
 

Melan

*eyeroll*
Jeez, I am here so rarely I almost missed this one.

There is some crossover, although we usually either play one game or the other - they scratch a slightly different itch, and we like some variety in our D&D. I offer human variants in most games. For example, here are the guidelines for our Fomalhaut campaign using Seven Voyages of Zylarthen - not quite AD&D, but close enough:

are normal men derived from a mixture of starfaring stock.
  • They receive +1 to all reaction rolls.
Amazons are descendants of gynarchic societies.
  • Amazons are -1 to hit by men (two Amazons fighting side by side gain -2).
  • Level limits: Fighting-Woman 9, Magic-User –, Thief 6
Cavemen are primitives from savage lands.
  • Owing to their strong metabolism, they are +2 to save vs. poison. They receive -1 on all reaction rolls.
  • Level limits: Fighting-Man 8, Magic-User 4, Thief 6
Etunians are horse-nomads known for a thoroughly pragmatic disposition.
  • They may engage in archery on the move or when mounted (“split move and fire”).
  • Level limits: Fighting-Man 9 , Magic-User 4, Thief 6
Imperials are purple-skinned schemers from a high-tech utopia, and advocates of Mung, its ideology of human progress.
  • They have a vague understanding of ancient technologies and their operation
  • Level limits: Fighting-Man 6, Magic-User 9, Thief 6
Northmen are fair of hair and great of stature. They are commonly shunned for their violent reputation and supposed intellectual inferiority.
  • They gain +1 Hp every odd level. They receive -1 on all reaction rolls.
  • Level limits: Fighting-Man 9, Magic-User –, Thief 6
I have also allowed the Fighter subclasses in some AD&D games, since these are simple, fast ways to differentiate characters. We don't use skills in either Zylarthen or AD&D, but do use these systems' respective Thief skills. The Zylarthen Thief is pretty cool; more Sindbad than Bilbo Baggins.
 

Hemlock

Should be playing D&D instead
It's a crappy spell because only a maniac PC will ever use it. That's your LOOT you're destroying. Unless you absolutely know that most of your opponent's equipment is unusable, evil-aligned or cursed, there's no return on hitting him with a disjunction.
I mean, maybe.

Fight a scary bad guy and there are at least four possible outcomes:

1. You win and walk away with his stuff.
2. You win and get nothing but XP.
3. He wins and gets nothing but XP.
4. He wins and walks away with your stuff.

If Mordenkainen's Disjunction can turn a hypothetical fight with Enlarged drow fighter/mages in magical chain mail +5 and shield +5 and longswords of life draining +5 with wands of Fireballs galore and several Hasted summoned balors from a #4 into a #2 or partial #1, maybe it's better than dying and getting looted.

I admit though that the main appeal to Mordy's Disjunction in my eyes has always been the fact that it automatically ends spells.
 

Osrnoob

Should be playing D&D instead
I am interested in your Zylarthen house rules! When you have a moment could you post here or DM me pretty please?

Been loving the K Empire and 12 Kingdoms adventures and setting in the Echoes Melan! Just purchased the forest adventure and plan to read over mead this weekend :D

The campaign I mentioned earlier is dormant for normal DnD reasons (schedules) but an infrequent game is a foot using my implementation of your tools! I am very proud of some hexes I carved out on nearby islands that players seem to really be enjoying. Dungeons beckon from the ruins a place named Santorini, the environment is other worldly and weirdly dying. Why is the climate of this place so unlike the nearby Isle of Erillion?
 
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