Illusions

[DangerousPuhson]

Regardless, cut to the chase of it. Are you saying you're offended by statements not endlessly and repetitiously prefaced with "This may only be for me, but..."? Is that the objection?

You again twist my words, and skew the intent of my posts so as to pick fights with the petty semantics of my messages - you take what I write, twist it into something sinister or stupid, then attack your own twisted version of what I'm saying. It's getting old.

This isn't about what does or doesn't offend, or how posts should or shouldn't be prefaced. This is about me saying "hey now, be careful with generalizations that won't necessarily apply to everyone", and apparently you disagree. How the hell can you have a problem with that message? Why do you think me pointing that out is somehow the same as me getting offended by something?

It's weird - as one of the few proponents of newer D&D on this forum, somehow everyone automatically assumes I'm only here to talk down about other systems and talk big about 5e ... I'm not. I hate system talk! I find it dry, tedious, and it usually leads to nothing but stupid arguments that spin off more tangents than a TI-82.

Read through my posts again. Like seriously, open my profile, go to Postings, and actually, really read through them with the approach of understanding why I posted what I've posted in the first place. You'll notice my statements are rarely concrete. I almost always leave some wiggle room, by prefacing with "Personally..." or "I don't believe..." or "In my opinion..." or "I prefer..." - there's always a degree of subjectivity in my posts. Either that, or what I mention is just advice ("That treasure sounds a little dull, maybe try this instead..."), not gospel.

 

[The Heretic]

@The Heretic : How's about these for some vintage long-winded posts? Eh? Have I still got it? Are you sick of my virtual voice yet? Did your eyes glaze over? Did you skip over most of it? (DP does! Bryce too!)

tl:dr

 

[Beoric]

Honestly, I can't figure out why it (Aliens-inspired monsters in D&D) hasn't already been done-to-death!

Go with wasps, which do this in real life, in lots of gruesome ways. With at least one variety, the eggs (or larvae, I can't remember) excrete hormones that change the behavior of the host so it is protective of them, even after they have chewed their way out. Google "wasp lay eggs in" and it should prompt you with a number of varieties of creatures that wasps lay their eggs in.

On resource tracking, I find my players have a lot more tolerance for it if they know they only have to do it until continual light and create food and water are available.

As I mentioned before, resource tracking is the sort of think computers would be good at. I don't think any of the current ones have built-in resource tracking with an easy UI, which I think is a missed opportunity, as I think that would be one of the best ways to reach the OSR crowd.

 

[squeen]

Go with wasps, which do this in real life, in lots of gruesome ways. With at least one variety, the eggs (or larvae, I can't remember) excrete hormones that change the behavior of the host so it is protective of them, even after they have chewed their way out. Google "wasp lay eggs in" and it should prompt you with a number of varieties of creatures that wasps lay their eggs in.

On resource tracking, I find my players have a lot more tolerance for it if they know they only have to do it until continual light and create food and water are available.

As I mentioned before, resource tracking is the sort of think computers would be good at. I don't think any of the current ones have built-in resource tracking with an easy UI, which I think is a missed opportunity, as I think that would be one of the best ways to reach the OSR crowd.

Spot on all counts.

The Alien from the first movie actually was not wasp inspired---read the Wikipedia article---but Aliens, the sequel changed that.

Still...why is this not a classic monster yet?

I keep resisting the introduction of computers in the D&D game. Maybe its because I spent so much time in front of one (and have since 1980), that I like the respite from the "digital drug".

 

[Malrex]

Make your own demon/devil up...would be more fun.

 

[The Heretic]

Zuggtmoy is boring. Sure, you have the ready made dungeon with her in it, but....blech. Thematically, what kind of portfolio for a demon lord would fit your campaign? Maybe go from there. You could always flesh out one of the names EGG had for demon lords/princes in MM2.

 

[squeen]

Zuggtmoy is boring. Sure, you have the ready made dungeon with her in it, but....blech. Thematically, what kind of portfolio for a demon lord would fit your campaign? Maybe go from there. You could always flesh out one of the names EGG had for demon lords/princes in MM2.

That's a really neat idea. Hmm...Which one...?

All the ones with apostrophes are immediately discarded because---ugh.
I'd consider Ahazu, Anarazel, Ardat, Azael, Azazel, Eblis, Gresil, Mastiphal, Mekir, Nocticula, and Verin.

I could also go Lovecraftian/Outer Gods: e.g.
Nyarlathotep (The Black Man)

or Hastur (The Yellow King).

Both of which are very tempting.

You are also the first person I know to have echoed my feelings about how lamed and not-scary Zuggtmoy is as a demon.
Heck, the whole ToEE (as written by Metzner) hopelessly and utterly fails to bring the terror or wonder IMO.

EDIT: To answer the question posed: Demon Lord portfolio that fits the campaign --- pretty basic and open really.

• made a pact with a human Witch Queen to grant her 1000 years of youthful life
• pronounced a curse upon a high-level elven magic-user to imprison him in chains for an equal amount of time (like Merlin trapped by Le Fey)
• otherwise fairly "off camera"
• has to be a DEMON LORD --- in the classic sense, not some "themed" lackey/oddball. Looms larger-than-life. No hope. Fire, Brimestone, Terror, the Abyss. Seemingly all-powerful. Conniving.
• the party has been "duped" into thinking all they need to do is find the demon's soul-amulet and compel it to lift the magician's curse. Easy peasy.

 

[squeen]

Maybe I'll steal the name Melkur from Dr. Who.

Quick! Name that episode (and villain for extra credit) WITHOUT Google.

First post gets a no-prize!

 

[DangerousPuhson]

Demon names

Demon name generator. 100,000's of combinations are available, you're bound to find one you like.

www.fantasynamegenerators.com

Demon names are random-sounding enough that you can get away with most anything.

 

[The Heretic]

Maybe I'll steal the name Melkur from Dr. Who.

Quick! Name that episode (and villain for extra credit) WITHOUT Google.

First post gets a no-prize!

Melkur? Sounds like a third rate Tolkien knock-off.

 

[The Heretic]

Also, I would be against using Nyarlathotep or the King in Yellow because that would cheapen the impact of the Cthulhu mythos. They should have no chance, no chance whatsoever when dealing with these beings. Hmm. I was going to get into this with my review of the Temple of Poseidon in Dragon magazine. I need to get back to that...

 

[squeen]

You make a good point. The agents of the Outer Gods are...well...god-like, and that's at a whole other level from demons.

However, I'd like this particular demon to invoke that same sophisticated sense of horror and fear --- and not be some sort of Big Flaming Orc.

To be clear, I was just going to rip off the names and appearance, not attempt to adhere to the Cthulhu mythos too closely.

Melkur is a Tolkien-name rip-off (Melkor) by Dr. Who. It was the 1970s---everyone ripped Tolkien off back then. Before the movies, Tolkien was like a secret club, especially the Silmarillion myths.

 

[Beoric]

Zuggtmoy is boring. Sure, you have the ready made dungeon with her in it, but....blech. Thematically, what kind of portfolio for a demon lord would fit your campaign? Maybe go from there. You could always flesh out one of the names EGG had for demon lords/princes in MM2.

Smash her together with Kyrzin from Eberron, and give her some affinity with the body's mucous, and parasitic slimes that infect your body, and other types of oozes like gibbering mouthers, and she gets more interesting. Cultists of Kyrzin often keep a gibbering mouther in the basement and feed their dead (or dying) to it, imagining that they can hear the voice of Kyrzin and their beloved ancestors in its babbling.

 

[The Heretic]

Zuggtmoy. 'Nuff Said.

 

[The Heretic]

You are also the first person I know to have echoed my feelings about how lamed and not-scary Zuggtmoy is as a demon.
Heck, the whole ToEE (as written by Metzner) hopelessly and utterly fails to bring the terror or wonder IMO.

I actually enjoyed T1-4 quite a bit. Loved it so much I bought and played the video game. But yeah, Zuggtmoy herself is kind of...boring.

Was I the only person who went first to the very back of the module to check out the cool new monsters?

 

[squeen]

No. I looked at the map, the drawings, and then straight to the back.

 

[squeen]

Also, I would be against using Nyarlathotep or the King in Yellow because that would cheapen the impact of the Cthulhu mythos. They should have no chance, no chance whatsoever when dealing with these beings. Hmm. I was going to get into this with my review of the Temple of Poseidon in Dragon magazine. I need to get back to that...

@The Heretic : You need to know how much this has resonated in my head. The players are having such a run of luck, I really needed to check my expectations in term of future content. If I/they are not careful, the party is likely to get massively pwned by any Demon Lord---let alone a demi-god.

My mind has wander...drunk on Plane Travel. They are up against their first demon (ever) when they lead the realm's army to save the Keep. Going to use the ACKS rules---FINALLY. We'll see how that goes. I am thinking a Balrog (Type VI), just based on the size and fire power the PCs are packing. I'm think that with his teleportation ability and what-not, if I don't totally botch it, we'll see some causalities.

At which point, they may decide its wiser to steer clear of any future demons altogether.

Truth be told, I am a poor DM. Too inexperienced at this level.

 

[squeen]

An attempt to draw a map of the next likely adventure location:

...a natural feature called Dragonshead Ford...for (I hope) obvious reason.



The map turned into a just perspective drawing because top-down waterfalls suck.

I got the vanishing point totally wrong, so squashed it vertically in GIMP --- helped a bit.

Kinda sucks. Shadows/lighting is inconsistent. Too small. Boring viewpoint. Etc.
Maybe it can be saved (or redrawn).

Hopefully obvious to them it's rocky on one side and forest on the other.

...and that an army crossing anywhere other than at the ford would be problematic.

Probably needs some figures in for scale.

Ugh. Trees. (Need shadows).

One thing I do like is the notion of remnants of old civilization littering the landscape. Not as major action points...but just setting. I think it also helps the players and DM mentally ear-mark a location. As in: "Back in that place with the giant foot..."

--------------------------------------

In contrast --- something done by a REAL artist (snatched from cyberspace), which is my inspiration for the Witch Queen Melice:



It was so long ago, I don't know where it's originally from.
(I think she looks like uncannily like Elon Musks' ex-wife, the actress.)

 

[DangerousPuhson]

An attempt to draw a map of the next likely adventure location:

Don't take this the wrong way because your artwork is nice, but in what way is a picture of a bridge, with no scale, grid, cardinal points, or anything beyond a road leading to and away from it, considered "a map"? That's just a picture of a bridge, not really a map, yes?

Not trying to shit on your work, but if that's a map, then what's stopping anyone from saying this is a map too? That is to say, what does your "map" offer that a simple text description doesn't, other than looking nice?

 

[squeen]

Was going to be a map --- ended up just being a picture.

Oh well.

EDIT: The real mapping pickle is how to hex-grid the space to use the ACKS Domains at War combat.
Why that turned into a drawing is anyone's guess.

Human army (8 units) vs two monster units (60 ogre light infantry, and 20 hill giants), with the latter having a serious terrain advantage.

The giants have been sent to slow the humans down so that they arrive too late to save the Keep. They picked the Dragonshead Ford as a choke point because the human army outnumbers them significantly.

Unknown to my players, the drow are pulling the strings (no surprise to the grognards, but my players are young). It was suppose to be a lead-in to G-series...back when I foolishly imagined it, oh so many years ago. Back then, I thought I'd get then chance to actually use some pre-generated modules (they are littered all over the map). We did B2, T1, Pod Caverns...and then...bupkis---never again in six years. ????